SF Vs. OC -- is one warmer?

Here, I've excerpted a debate between myself and another person over what may or may not be an imaginary letter written from a boss to his employees. It deals with the stimulus package and how he interprets it's being used.

Realistically, the OC is warmer and has better beaches. However, there's a definitely a cold shoulder that both the OC and SF feel they need to turn on one another, based on the differing political beliefs of the populations that reside there. It intrigues me how these geographical patterns develop throughout the United States (clearly tied to a complex history), but even more how they develop within a State. And California isn't the only state. Illinois, where I grew up, though it goes "blue" everytime, has one of the most conservative counties in the mid-west in its grips; the county right next store to my home town: DuPage County. We could talk about average incomes, levels of education, socio-economics and really get into why these differences exist, but I bore my students enough with these things, so I'll just give you a more entertaining snippet as evidence of the difference. By the way, all three writers grew up in the same town (it's me, and two others here).

Read the letter we're responding to first. Here: "To All My Valued Employees"

Speaker #1 (excerpted)

This letter is an extraordindary oversimplification and generalization of what is currently happening in this nation and what has happened in the previous 8-10 years in this nation.

I would wager to bet that this 'boss' is someone who probably supported the idea of invading Iraq, a war that has caused us thousands of American lives, a war that solved nothing, a war that shouldn't have been entered into in the first place. We were willing to (and most republicans want to continue to spend) so far spend over $700 billion dollars in Iraq, rebuilding a country that we destroyed in the first place for no reason (other than for private American contracting firms to be brought in to rebuild Iraq with no bid contracts), but now people are not willing to spend $1 trillion dollars to try rebuilding our own nation. This is twisted....

...It's an extremely ignorant and poorly researched statement to insinuate that this stimulus package is specifically focused to help the lowest of the lower class...the people on welfare. That is a ridiculous statement and it's ridiculous to applaud a comment like that. That statement is not at all founded in facts.

This country needs to be fixed by our ingenuity. Ingenuity cannot be motivated by financial possbilities. It has to be motivated by creativity and intelligence. This country and the major corporations that in essence sway the pendulum of how our economy shifts have been led by greed and not creativity and intelligence....

"There is no balance in our system and very few things run well without balance. We need a balance between realism and idealism in this nation. I would argue that most of the financial messes that have been created have been a result of a lack of either of these things, let alone a balance of the two.

People might think things are moving in a socialist way with all this regulation, but the only reason regulation is being talked about is because the capitalistic model created a completely out of balance situation and has single handedly (actually coupled with an American public that stupidly continued to buy products and support these giant companies) created the mess we're in now. Our nation is in this current problem because in the eyes of the powers at be, greed and $80 million dollar ceo salaries were found to be more important than anything else. There were no checks and there were no balances. And the chances are, if you found that "boss' letter to be profound, then these are"

Speaker #2 (Me!)

"Hooray to you for taking the time to post such an empassioned reply. There's an obvious sense of injustice that exists on both sides of this argument. However, I think the boss's inability to understand the opposite side rests in a pretty shallow belief that both his workers and "welfare moms" have never known hard work. This is a statement that I hear often from people who merely observe the lives of others who seem to struggle. My personal, everyday work with families who deal with this has provided enough evidence for me to believe otherwise. There is also a pretty fascinating assumption that everyone wants to work enough to drive a mercedes, have a big car and a vacation house. Since becoming a professional, I've never worked less than a 60 hour work week, but I do it for entirely different reasons that "the boss" assumes.

If I were single, I would barely make ends meet. But, I would find a way. Does that mean I don't think I'm worth more? No. Does that mean I'm complaining? No. I like my job, but the reality is that there are many people who work very, very hard at jobs they like and have chosen (and that this country needs them to do!), that don't make very much money. "The boss" assumes that these people are lazy or have no drive. The alternatives are abundant, but he has probably not taken the time to explore these.

I understand frustration when I see and hear it. And his note is exasperated frustration that I do feel sorry for. My hope is that there is a clear-headed, balanced answer for all the people who are suffering right now. And that will take patience and understanding from us all.Hooray to you for taking the time to post such an empassioned reply. There's an obvious sense of injustice that exists on both sides of this argument. However, I think the boss's inability to understand the opposite side rests in a pretty shallow belief that both his workers and "welfare moms" have never known hard work. This is a statement that I hear often from people who merely observe the lives of others who seem to struggle. My personal, everyday work with families who deal with this has provided enough evidence for me to believe otherwise. There is also a pretty fascinating assumption that everyone wants to work enough to drive a mercedes, have a big car and a vacation house. Since becoming a professional, I've never worked less than a 60 hour work week, but I do it for entirely different reasons that "the boss" assumes."

Speaker #3 (poster of "boss" letter)

I love how everyone just proves the point of this letter. Welcome to the United States of America where we all have the choice to do what we want with our lives. We have the CHOICE and that is exactly it!! I have no sympathy for anyone who chooses a career path where there is no MONEY. You know that going into the career so quit your bitching! Others choose career paths that will give them financial independence and happiness. This is the LAND OF OPPORTUNITY!! Take your fearless leader for example. He is a black man that became the President of the United States! So don't sit here and act like people are just unfortunate and don't have the opportunity to do something with their lives!! It's people like you who JUST DON"T GET IT!!

Speaker #2 (me!)

"We do have choices and that's a wonderful thing. For instance, I made the choice to use language in my reply that wasn't insulting. And, frankly, I'm insulted. I chose my career because it would make me happy, and, yes, I could have chosen a much more lucrative career. But, I find my job very satisfying. I wasn't complaining; I'm very grateful for the life I have and do not see financial freedom and happiness as synonomous. I do see my job as important and, frankly, it allows people who have no concern about how the impoverished in this country work themselves out of poverty-- which is through education not tax breaks, we agree there-- to not have to worry about who does the "dirty work" of actually helping people out of poverty. The point is, this country is not just about business and profit margins, and take-home pay, the greatest decade (and most prosperous) was also the most progressive: The New Deal.

This country is about finding the creative, yet untried solution to our problems. It was then, and it will be still today. That's something I do get."

Speaker #3

"FINDING THE CREATIVE IS FOR 'CRYSTAL GRIPPING HIPPIES'"
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Well, it goes on from there, with people weighing in, mostly with more thoughtful refutations, experience or fact-based. Certainly, I find it amusing to be thought of as a crystal gripping hippie. But, the real scary part is the tone of hatred that comes across here. I was pretty shocked, but perhaps I wasn't being as nice as I thought? There are so many arguments to be had over ideology, but the problem with ideology is that it is just that, ideology. When people get locked into these firm beliefs, we tend to ignore the experience or fact that proves otherwise. I know I have done this, I'm guilty of it, but so much of what I believe politically seems tied to my ethical and moral values that ideology often prevails. This is true of the other side. However, I don't hate those on the other side. Though, Speaker #3 makes it hard not to believe that she merely imbibes rhetoric. Beware of the talking points, kids...

And this is when one of my students raises his hands and asks, "Can I go to the bathroom?"

For fuck's sake! I mean, "Yes, after you tell me what ideology is."